Waldo Jaquith (JAKE-with) is an open government technologist who lives near Charlottesville, VA, USA. more »
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39 replies on “5 bands I know I’m supposed to like but I just don’t.”
I’m a big fan of Jack White’s work in 2004 with Loretta Lynn, on Van Lear Rose. If you haven’t heard the CD, you really should look into it.
I like Loretta Lynn, I just didn’t see what White added to the album.
All MM, or just their newer work (Moon and Antartica, Good News)?
I admit I can’t get enough of This Is A Long Drive for Someone With Nothing to Think About. And while their music, and Brock’s voice, can most definatly be abrasive, lyrics such as “Opinions were like kittens, I was giving them away” oddly enough keep me listening.
All Modest Mouse.
I can never bring myself to like bruce springsteen even though I know I ought ot like him.
I second Springsteen. I’m glad I’m not the only one.
For me, bands like Franz Ferdinand especially would be much better if I didn’t hear them ad nauseum (or if a certain former co-worker didn’t play Hot Fuss fifteen times a day).
But, Take Me Out does have a fascinatingly weird structure.
Have you heard any of Sufjan Stevens’ music? His “illinoise” is the best album I’ve heard recently.
We saw a band at the Prism a few months ago that we love. Crooked Still is bluegrass with a cello, double bass, banjo and a haunting voice.
I’ve always put Pink Floyd (though I do kinda like some of the solo stuff by Roger Waters) and Led Zepplin in that catagory.
U2 is the greatest band in the world……but how can you NOT love the Beastie Boys? Talk about talent; they can do punk, hip hop, free style, anything. Very underated artist, and one of the more influential artists in hip-hop. IMO
Dave Matthews Band is in my top 5 of all time, and I think that Dave is one of the best American songwriters of all time. The fact that DMB has one only 1 Grammy is an absolute travesty.
The in thing from way out is the best instrumental rock album of all time. I gotta go get my “bodhisattva vow” on.
Is that true? I thought U2 would have more Grammies than Mariah by now.
Correction, U2 is the most over-rated, full-of-themselves band in the world. If Bono would take those stupid sunglasses off to meet the Pope then I’ll take another look. They’re just another rock band in a genre crowded with better competition. Black Rebel Motorcycle Club beats the pants off of U2 any day of the week.
The Dave Matthews Band. Ugh. Where to even start? I guess their first 2 albums were neat. Since then they’ve turned into boring, adult contemporary schlock. It’s like Kenny G with vocals. Each of them is certainly very talented in terms of proficiency with their instuments. I won’t deny that they are a very tight band with very complex arrangements. And Dave is definitely a good guy and all. But you could say the same thing about the Lawrence Welk Band. Their music is just all so painfully boring and schlocky that I want to puke every time I hear them.
politicalopinion,
Come to think of it, even their one Grammy was really Peter Greisar’s Grammy. He wrote the song. Peter Greisar’s best stuff has been far better than the DMB’s stuff for years. Peter was the real talent. There’s a reason why DMB’s music got so boring after they ran out of material that Peter had written.
Peter Griesar is to the DMB what Brian Eno was to Roxy Music. Or what Peter Gabriel was to Genesis. Yeah, they kept going without him and sold albums, made some money. But we all know when the really good stuff happened and why it stopped.
The in thing from way out is the best instrumental rock album of all time.
It is seriously an awesome album, and it’s what makes me like the Beastie Boys. But anything other than that compilation — that is, anything with vocals — makes me feel like I’m being yelled at. And if I want to be yelled at, I’ll take my pants off at the zoo.
“U2 is the most over-rated, full-of-themselves band in the world……. They’re just another rock band in a genre crowded with better competition.”
Well, you’re entitled to your opinion but to even but Black Rebel Motorcyle Club in U2’s category is absurd. For one, part of U2’s greatness is the ability to stay relevent, change styles and maintin commercial and critical success well into their third decade.
Will the Black Rebels be able to say that in the 2020’s?
I doubt it.
U2’s ability to reinvent themsevles is part of their genius, from a quasi punk band (Boy) to atmosphiric etheral music (Unforgettable Fire) to American influenced rock (Joshua Tree/ Rattle and Hum) to distorted Euro rock (Achtung Baby/Zooropa) to just experimental reinvention (Passengers/ Pop) back to just plain rock and roll (All That You Can’t Leave Behind / Atomic Bomb) it’s been a joy to follow their musical journey.
Bottom line, U2 rose to fame when the vast majority of “mainstream” bands of the day were hair metal bands singing about sex, drugs and rock n’ roll. Here comes a band from Ireland that sings about God, social issues and politics and still achieves mega stardom.
You can call them a “full-of-themselves” band, but over-rated? Not by a long shot.
They are still the best live band I’ve ever seen and their concert I attended a little over a month after 9/11 was simply unreal.
Don’t get me wrong – it’s not that I hate U2. I’ve enjoyed much of their music. I just don’t think that they’re anywhere near as great as they are made out to be. I would put them in my top 100 list of rock bands but definitely not in a top 10 list. And hey, top 100 is still pretty good.
I ain’t much on Springstein either but “The Ghost of Tom Joad” was probably worth getting. Wasn’t much on U2 either til I heard some of their songs in other genres and realized that I like them like I like Dylan. Good songs, but…
I’m too damn old to have heard of the groups mentioned in the beginning, heh, heh!
The Tramp
Jack,
I don’t agree with your Pete Griesar’s analogy by a long shot. Did DMB write some great music with Peter? Yes. But come on, Before These Crowded Streets is probably DMB at their creative peak, and Griesar had nothing to do with that album.
As far as Dave’s songwriting credentials, I would put his list of songs up against Griesar’s anyday.
Matisyahu the Hasidic rapper.
I am Jewish and would really like to like him, but I don’t get it. Bob Marley was good. I am sorry to say that Matisyahu is no Bob Marley from what I can tell.
I guess my namesake tells you how I feel about Springsteen…I find U2’s earlier music (Under a Bloodred Sky) better than the Joshua Tree which is what all of cool kids talk about. I think Achtung Baby is my favorite of all their albums because it was such a shift from their earlier work.
if you ask me, you’re only “supposed to” like the Beastie Boys. it’s acceptable to only like Paul’s Boutique, though.
Modest Mouse have sucked since 1999. before that they were pretty great… like if the pixies did sad cowboy songs and daniel johnston was their singer.
the other 3 bands were never even worthy of my attention to begin with. actually i don’t think i’ve even heard Death Cab, but i’m certainly not anxious to do so.
[this concludes my obnoxious music snob rant… you may now go back to your own regularly scheduled opinions]
bands / musicians that i’m supposed to like but actually hate include:
1) Led Zeppelin
2) Bob Marley
3) Bruce Springsteen
4) T Rex
5) Devandra Banhart
apart from Zep’s “Kashmir” and the first Tyrannasaurus Rex album, i absolutely can’t stand to hear any of these.
That reminds me Waldo, I won the bet. When White Blood Cells came out you said that no one would remember them in a couple years. Well, love ’em or hate ’em, Get Behind Me Satan won best alternative album at the Grammys. I was rooting for Arcade Fire, but it really was a good album.
And to those that say they don’t like The Boss. If you have not heard Nebraska, you can’t officially hate the Bruce. That’s the one take him or leave him album. It totally turn me around about him.
just incase anyone has any doubts that i’m really a horrible snob, here are —
Five Bands who started putting out painfully terrible albums as soon as everyone else started paying attention to them, so that i suddenly went from being the only person who liked them to being a grumpy bastard who talked about how much better they used to be:
(ranked from most-drastic-turnarounds at the top, to still-might-end-up-OK ones at the bottom)
Music snobs are so boring. “I like bands no one has heard of! I rock!” Yawn. It’s against all probablity that ALL bands that are popular suck. If you only like under-the-radar bands that really means you like being cool better than you actually like music. It should be all about the music. Does it move you? Does it say something to you? Or are you looking at images of the band, the press’s reaction to the band, the audience, etc.
James (et al), enjoy your Hello My Name is Music Snob badge. That and a goatee will get you a wink from a tatooed barrister at Starbucks.
P.S. Animal Collective is great. But so are Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers.
liked animal collective untill I saw them at the black cat. no longer like. very bad show. very bad.
Who has their Wilco tickets?!
not to put a music snob badge on . . . but modest mouse was rad before they went major, then they sucked.
lonesome crowded west. that is all I have to say.
the Books where just in cville, no? anyone see them?
Music snobs are so boring. “I like bands no one has heard of! I rock!” Yawn.
Uh. Who are you criticizing? The only little-known bands named here are in the context of dislike. I understand you’ve got a hobby horse of people who like things that you don’t know about, but I think you’ve jumped the gun here.
here are Five Very Popular [bands / musicians] that I Like Very Much:
1. the Beatles
2. James Brown
3. the Beach Boys
4. Prince
5. Radiohead
PS — not only do i not go to starbucks, i can’t even grow a goatee. it’s not that i’m not old enough. it’s just that i’m a wussy little sissy-boy.
actually i think it was sort of valid criticism, although mis-informed… i was basically saying that there are bands that i liked when they were obscure that i dislike now that they’ve achieved a certain level of popularity. BUT– for what it’s worth (and i’m self-conscious enough that this fact makes me uncomfortable… i’m not really much of a snob) it’s just that these bands really did start sucking. i don’t dislike these bands because they got some recognition… i dislike them because they started releasing terrible music.
the way i see it, the popularity of certain bands or songs, arguably disproportional to their quality, is a symptom of the vast corporate ownership of music production and distribution. U2 are a pretty good band, i listen to them now and then, but i don’t think they are the best rock band of the past 30 years. but they’ve been promoted to such a degree that the numbers would seem to indicate this. sure, you might really like their music. you might have some fond memories of growing up with it. a lot of us do, and there’s nothing wrong with that. but i just don’t think that that’s emperical evidence of their quality.
in the past few years, the big-money music industry has done an appallingly poor job of a) finding musical acts that people will like and b) promoting them sufficiently. they’re just trying to recycle the same shit over and over again, and they think of the internet (and, by extentsion, their consumers) as the enemy rather than an ally. as a result, the “industry” is doing terribly (especially by their own insanely optomistic economic standards) while independently-published music is starting to thrive.
This is good, but it’s not the messianic triumph of “indie” that some make it out to be. it’s true that many people’s interest in music is less centered around major-label interests than 10 years ago. but my complaint it that it’s still centered somewhere. lionizing “freak-folk” and attempting to revive post-punk and putting the Arcade Fire on magazine covers might be more interesting than continuing to pay attention to Janet Jackson, but it does little to solve what i see as a problem — that people still pay a disproportionate amount of attention to musicians of widely varying quality while many, many, many hardworking and talented artists still have to make music as a hobby while working a crummy office day-job.
i mean, it’s true that i listen to obscure stuff that nobody’s ever heard of. right now i’m really into Sunroof! and Utabi and Secret Mommy, and i’m trying to find more records by World’s End Girlfriend and Jewelled Antler Collective. but i don’t like these things because they’re obscure. it’s not like i sit at home relishing over the fact that i found some weird things nobody knows about and that makes me cooler than them (maybe i thought that when i was 15, but everybody did stupid stuff when they were that age.) obscurity is not emperical proof of quality an more than popularity is.
i’d like these bands (Secret Mommy in particular… damn that guy is good) to be more recognized than they are currently. that’s why i rant like a maniac at anyone who will listen about how good they are. that’s why i make mix-tapes in bulk and hand them out to strangers. basically, it’s why i’m a DJ. it’s not that i seek out obscure things because i want to gloat about my imaginary hipster status. i seek out obscure things because i love music and i love hearing new sounds and i want to share them with as many people as possible. but i don’t want to see those acts on MTV… that would defeat my purpose. i want for the process of music production and consumption to become far more egalitarian and diverse and thinly-spread. i want the talented people who put a lot into their amazing music to get a lot out of it too– for them to be able to support themselves doing what they love. but that doesn’t mean we should all be drooling over Johanna Newsom’s haircut or whatever. partially because that’s just mimicking the bullshit taste-making corporate structure that got us into this mess in the first place, and also because i have a theory that it leads certain acts to become really self-conscious in the lime-light and they start producing bad work as a result (that’s my theory about what happened to The Books, anyway)
You don’t like Deathcab?
I Will Follow You into the Dark?
Different Names for the Same thing?
Transatlanticism?
How can you miss out on such great tunes? :)
I got my Wilco ticket!
I’m not of the cult of U2, but they are pretty good. And with Eno, they’re damn good. I agree that they are over hyped though.
Bands I just can’t bring myself to be crazy over.
1. Coldplay
2. The Dandy Warhols (I’m trying though, but seeing that video for Last High REALLY didn’t help!)
3. Phish
4. Guns and Roses
5. New Order (Again, I’m trying. Any first album suggestions?)
For someone who is really into music, there is a real and tangible joy in discovering something no one has heard of . . . its like discovering a land nobody has ever stepped foot in.
So, I don’t think James has to defend that!
It is awesome to find something new and turn other people on to it. This is a very, very common thing, read Gladwell’s “Tipping Point”; it is how ideas are spread.
But to his other points: I would argue that it is not just corporate promotion that propels a band like U2. U2 did something that huge amount of people really loved.
Now people who are music-philes, might say that its quality is just ok, but the masses who don’t want to think about it, loved it.
I think that is fine, its kind of like difference between a $100 bottle of wine and a $20 dollar bottle of wine: 95% of the public couldn’t tell them apart, me included! If it tastes like alcohol then its fine by me.
As far as the quality of the music industry . . . hmmm, is it the same thing that is affecting the movie industry? because that sucks too . . . “Trash”, whoops I mean “Crash”, I left that movie with the biggest head ache from getting hit over the head so many times.
And as far as bands producing bad work as a result of success, maybe.
Maybe it is just the nature of success: when you are poor and lack recourses you have to be more creative. I think that describes the problem better than “corporate pressure”
I think that it is a rare artist who can maintain the creativity that propelled their success. Creativity is simply problem solving, thats all it is, and when you don’t have as many “problems” to solve, your art can suffer.
Most of my favorite musicians are unknowns, but I can’t see how that makes me a music snob. Shannon Worrell, Devon Sproule, Peter Griesar, Corey Harris, Brady Earnhart, The Hackensaw Boys, Lauren Hoffman, The Hogwaller Ramblers, and John D’earth are all among my very favorite musicians. I can’t see that it makes me a snob that they’re not more famous—their lack of fame is hardly my fault.
Death Cab For Cutie kicks all @ss in the known universe.
Alright, well, they don’t really kick any @ss.
But they are awesome.
Cory-
My recommendation is to give New Order’s “Brotherhood” a listen, as it’s by far their finest album (in my never-humble opinion).
And you’re perfectly fine to go on not liking Guns ‘N’ Roses. Because they suck.
love,
Patrick
Waldo, he said repeatedly throughout his posts (ok, maybe 4 or 5 times, but still…) that he was a music snob. He seemed to wear it like a badge of honor. I don’t think I was off base criticizing him for being a snob.
James, I agree with the majority of your last post. You’re not really a snob, in the “I want to be cool” sense. You just like different stuff.
Same thing with you Waldo. I’ve never seen you post about what you like in an effort to further your “cred”.
What I was ranting against were people who think they’re cool in being under-the-radar with their musical choices. As if that somehow defines them. (james has qualified his statements and his post proves he’s not one of those people).
I like many underground bands and I like many popular bands. None of my choices should define me or tell YOU (collective or individual) anything about who I am. Or make me cool or uncool. As Jon said, discovering new music is one of the joys of my life. It is a passion. I have a problem with people who name drop unknown bands thinking they are better than those who don’t know those bands. That’s stupid.
Anyone who has read Nick Hornby’s High Fidelity will know what I’m talking about. The theme is: It’s not what you like, it’s what you’re like, that matters.
P.S. Also, just read this from Waldo: “you’ve got a hobby horse of people who like things that you don’t know about”. No, sorry, I am aware of all the bands mentioned. That was the point in my original P.S. mentioning both Animal Collective and Tom Petty. I know the music, I just don’t think it’s a crime to like, for instance, U2 AND Prefuse 73.
yeah, i mean, i WAS calling myself a snob. it’s a half-joke self-depricating humor thing. maybe it doesn’t work too well over the internet. whatever, no offense has been taken or incurred. i don’t really care if you internet-strangers think i’m a snob or not, i’m just trying to add some interesting thoughts to the conversation.
i’m gonna go listen to Negativland’s “U2” now.
“…i just can’t seem to find it. i have kissed honey lips, and i’ve felt the feeling in her fingertips… i’ve even done that! and while i was doing that, you know, all the kissing on the honey lips, it burned like fire, and it reminded me of cheap melting plastic…”
Thanks Patrick, will do.
Oh and Waldo. Your list makes you more of a local than an indie snob. I’d say they are slightly different breeds. Or perhaps I’m trying to dodge the snob badge. Nah. I’ve openly called myself a music junky. They just seem to be different crowds. Maybe it’s a genre thing.
I’m a big fan of Jack White’s work in 2004 with Loretta Lynn, on Van Lear Rose. If you haven’t heard the CD, you really should look into it.
I like Loretta Lynn, I just didn’t see what White added to the album.
All MM, or just their newer work (Moon and Antartica, Good News)?
I admit I can’t get enough of This Is A Long Drive for Someone With Nothing to Think About. And while their music, and Brock’s voice, can most definatly be abrasive, lyrics such as “Opinions were like kittens, I was giving them away” oddly enough keep me listening.
All Modest Mouse.
I can never bring myself to like bruce springsteen even though I know I ought ot like him.
I second Springsteen. I’m glad I’m not the only one.
For me, bands like Franz Ferdinand especially would be much better if I didn’t hear them ad nauseum (or if a certain former co-worker didn’t play Hot Fuss fifteen times a day).
But, Take Me Out does have a fascinatingly weird structure.
Have you heard any of Sufjan Stevens’ music? His “illinoise” is the best album I’ve heard recently.
We saw a band at the Prism a few months ago that we love. Crooked Still is bluegrass with a cello, double bass, banjo and a haunting voice.
I’ve always put Pink Floyd (though I do kinda like some of the solo stuff by Roger Waters) and Led Zepplin in that catagory.
U2 is the greatest band in the world……but how can you NOT love the Beastie Boys? Talk about talent; they can do punk, hip hop, free style, anything. Very underated artist, and one of the more influential artists in hip-hop. IMO
Dave Matthews Band is in my top 5 of all time, and I think that Dave is one of the best American songwriters of all time. The fact that DMB has one only 1 Grammy is an absolute travesty.
The in thing from way out is the best instrumental rock album of all time. I gotta go get my “bodhisattva vow” on.
Is that true? I thought U2 would have more Grammies than Mariah by now.
Correction, U2 is the most over-rated, full-of-themselves band in the world. If Bono would take those stupid sunglasses off to meet the Pope then I’ll take another look. They’re just another rock band in a genre crowded with better competition. Black Rebel Motorcycle Club beats the pants off of U2 any day of the week.
The Dave Matthews Band. Ugh. Where to even start? I guess their first 2 albums were neat. Since then they’ve turned into boring, adult contemporary schlock. It’s like Kenny G with vocals. Each of them is certainly very talented in terms of proficiency with their instuments. I won’t deny that they are a very tight band with very complex arrangements. And Dave is definitely a good guy and all. But you could say the same thing about the Lawrence Welk Band. Their music is just all so painfully boring and schlocky that I want to puke every time I hear them.
politicalopinion,
Come to think of it, even their one Grammy was really Peter Greisar’s Grammy. He wrote the song. Peter Greisar’s best stuff has been far better than the DMB’s stuff for years. Peter was the real talent. There’s a reason why DMB’s music got so boring after they ran out of material that Peter had written.
Peter Griesar is to the DMB what Brian Eno was to Roxy Music. Or what Peter Gabriel was to Genesis. Yeah, they kept going without him and sold albums, made some money. But we all know when the really good stuff happened and why it stopped.
It is seriously an awesome album, and it’s what makes me like the Beastie Boys. But anything other than that compilation — that is, anything with vocals — makes me feel like I’m being yelled at. And if I want to be yelled at, I’ll take my pants off at the zoo.
“U2 is the most over-rated, full-of-themselves band in the world……. They’re just another rock band in a genre crowded with better competition.”
Well, you’re entitled to your opinion but to even but Black Rebel Motorcyle Club in U2’s category is absurd. For one, part of U2’s greatness is the ability to stay relevent, change styles and maintin commercial and critical success well into their third decade.
Will the Black Rebels be able to say that in the 2020’s?
I doubt it.
U2’s ability to reinvent themsevles is part of their genius, from a quasi punk band (Boy) to atmosphiric etheral music (Unforgettable Fire) to American influenced rock (Joshua Tree/ Rattle and Hum) to distorted Euro rock (Achtung Baby/Zooropa) to just experimental reinvention (Passengers/ Pop) back to just plain rock and roll (All That You Can’t Leave Behind / Atomic Bomb) it’s been a joy to follow their musical journey.
Bottom line, U2 rose to fame when the vast majority of “mainstream” bands of the day were hair metal bands singing about sex, drugs and rock n’ roll. Here comes a band from Ireland that sings about God, social issues and politics and still achieves mega stardom.
You can call them a “full-of-themselves” band, but over-rated? Not by a long shot.
They are still the best live band I’ve ever seen and their concert I attended a little over a month after 9/11 was simply unreal.
Don’t get me wrong – it’s not that I hate U2. I’ve enjoyed much of their music. I just don’t think that they’re anywhere near as great as they are made out to be. I would put them in my top 100 list of rock bands but definitely not in a top 10 list. And hey, top 100 is still pretty good.
I ain’t much on Springstein either but “The Ghost of Tom Joad” was probably worth getting. Wasn’t much on U2 either til I heard some of their songs in other genres and realized that I like them like I like Dylan. Good songs, but…
I’m too damn old to have heard of the groups mentioned in the beginning, heh, heh!
The Tramp
Jack,
I don’t agree with your Pete Griesar’s analogy by a long shot. Did DMB write some great music with Peter? Yes. But come on, Before These Crowded Streets is probably DMB at their creative peak, and Griesar had nothing to do with that album.
As far as Dave’s songwriting credentials, I would put his list of songs up against Griesar’s anyday.
Matisyahu the Hasidic rapper.
I am Jewish and would really like to like him, but I don’t get it. Bob Marley was good. I am sorry to say that Matisyahu is no Bob Marley from what I can tell.
I guess my namesake tells you how I feel about Springsteen…I find U2’s earlier music (Under a Bloodred Sky) better than the Joshua Tree which is what all of cool kids talk about. I think Achtung Baby is my favorite of all their albums because it was such a shift from their earlier work.
if you ask me, you’re only “supposed to” like the Beastie Boys. it’s acceptable to only like Paul’s Boutique, though.
Modest Mouse have sucked since 1999. before that they were pretty great… like if the pixies did sad cowboy songs and daniel johnston was their singer.
the other 3 bands were never even worthy of my attention to begin with. actually i don’t think i’ve even heard Death Cab, but i’m certainly not anxious to do so.
[this concludes my obnoxious music snob rant… you may now go back to your own regularly scheduled opinions]
bands / musicians that i’m supposed to like but actually hate include:
1) Led Zeppelin
2) Bob Marley
3) Bruce Springsteen
4) T Rex
5) Devandra Banhart
apart from Zep’s “Kashmir” and the first Tyrannasaurus Rex album, i absolutely can’t stand to hear any of these.
That reminds me Waldo, I won the bet. When White Blood Cells came out you said that no one would remember them in a couple years. Well, love ’em or hate ’em, Get Behind Me Satan won best alternative album at the Grammys. I was rooting for Arcade Fire, but it really was a good album.
And to those that say they don’t like The Boss. If you have not heard Nebraska, you can’t officially hate the Bruce. That’s the one take him or leave him album. It totally turn me around about him.
just incase anyone has any doubts that i’m really a horrible snob, here are —
Five Bands who started putting out painfully terrible albums as soon as everyone else started paying attention to them, so that i suddenly went from being the only person who liked them to being a grumpy bastard who talked about how much better they used to be:
1. Múm
2. the Books
3. Animal Collective
4. MF Doom
5. Prefuse 73
(ranked from most-drastic-turnarounds at the top, to still-might-end-up-OK ones at the bottom)
Music snobs are so boring. “I like bands no one has heard of! I rock!” Yawn. It’s against all probablity that ALL bands that are popular suck. If you only like under-the-radar bands that really means you like being cool better than you actually like music. It should be all about the music. Does it move you? Does it say something to you? Or are you looking at images of the band, the press’s reaction to the band, the audience, etc.
James (et al), enjoy your Hello My Name is Music Snob badge. That and a goatee will get you a wink from a tatooed barrister at Starbucks.
P.S. Animal Collective is great. But so are Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers.
liked animal collective untill I saw them at the black cat. no longer like. very bad show. very bad.
Who has their Wilco tickets?!
not to put a music snob badge on . . . but modest mouse was rad before they went major, then they sucked.
lonesome crowded west. that is all I have to say.
the Books where just in cville, no? anyone see them?
Uh. Who are you criticizing? The only little-known bands named here are in the context of dislike. I understand you’ve got a hobby horse of people who like things that you don’t know about, but I think you’ve jumped the gun here.
here are Five Very Popular [bands / musicians] that I Like Very Much:
1. the Beatles
2. James Brown
3. the Beach Boys
4. Prince
5. Radiohead
PS — not only do i not go to starbucks, i can’t even grow a goatee. it’s not that i’m not old enough. it’s just that i’m a wussy little sissy-boy.
actually i think it was sort of valid criticism, although mis-informed… i was basically saying that there are bands that i liked when they were obscure that i dislike now that they’ve achieved a certain level of popularity. BUT– for what it’s worth (and i’m self-conscious enough that this fact makes me uncomfortable… i’m not really much of a snob) it’s just that these bands really did start sucking. i don’t dislike these bands because they got some recognition… i dislike them because they started releasing terrible music.
the way i see it, the popularity of certain bands or songs, arguably disproportional to their quality, is a symptom of the vast corporate ownership of music production and distribution. U2 are a pretty good band, i listen to them now and then, but i don’t think they are the best rock band of the past 30 years. but they’ve been promoted to such a degree that the numbers would seem to indicate this. sure, you might really like their music. you might have some fond memories of growing up with it. a lot of us do, and there’s nothing wrong with that. but i just don’t think that that’s emperical evidence of their quality.
in the past few years, the big-money music industry has done an appallingly poor job of a) finding musical acts that people will like and b) promoting them sufficiently. they’re just trying to recycle the same shit over and over again, and they think of the internet (and, by extentsion, their consumers) as the enemy rather than an ally. as a result, the “industry” is doing terribly (especially by their own insanely optomistic economic standards) while independently-published music is starting to thrive.
This is good, but it’s not the messianic triumph of “indie” that some make it out to be. it’s true that many people’s interest in music is less centered around major-label interests than 10 years ago. but my complaint it that it’s still centered somewhere. lionizing “freak-folk” and attempting to revive post-punk and putting the Arcade Fire on magazine covers might be more interesting than continuing to pay attention to Janet Jackson, but it does little to solve what i see as a problem — that people still pay a disproportionate amount of attention to musicians of widely varying quality while many, many, many hardworking and talented artists still have to make music as a hobby while working a crummy office day-job.
i mean, it’s true that i listen to obscure stuff that nobody’s ever heard of. right now i’m really into Sunroof! and Utabi and Secret Mommy, and i’m trying to find more records by World’s End Girlfriend and Jewelled Antler Collective. but i don’t like these things because they’re obscure. it’s not like i sit at home relishing over the fact that i found some weird things nobody knows about and that makes me cooler than them (maybe i thought that when i was 15, but everybody did stupid stuff when they were that age.) obscurity is not emperical proof of quality an more than popularity is.
i’d like these bands (Secret Mommy in particular… damn that guy is good) to be more recognized than they are currently. that’s why i rant like a maniac at anyone who will listen about how good they are. that’s why i make mix-tapes in bulk and hand them out to strangers. basically, it’s why i’m a DJ. it’s not that i seek out obscure things because i want to gloat about my imaginary hipster status. i seek out obscure things because i love music and i love hearing new sounds and i want to share them with as many people as possible. but i don’t want to see those acts on MTV… that would defeat my purpose. i want for the process of music production and consumption to become far more egalitarian and diverse and thinly-spread. i want the talented people who put a lot into their amazing music to get a lot out of it too– for them to be able to support themselves doing what they love. but that doesn’t mean we should all be drooling over Johanna Newsom’s haircut or whatever. partially because that’s just mimicking the bullshit taste-making corporate structure that got us into this mess in the first place, and also because i have a theory that it leads certain acts to become really self-conscious in the lime-light and they start producing bad work as a result (that’s my theory about what happened to The Books, anyway)
You don’t like Deathcab?
I Will Follow You into the Dark?
Different Names for the Same thing?
Transatlanticism?
How can you miss out on such great tunes? :)
I got my Wilco ticket!
I’m not of the cult of U2, but they are pretty good. And with Eno, they’re damn good. I agree that they are over hyped though.
Bands I just can’t bring myself to be crazy over.
1. Coldplay
2. The Dandy Warhols (I’m trying though, but seeing that video for Last High REALLY didn’t help!)
3. Phish
4. Guns and Roses
5. New Order (Again, I’m trying. Any first album suggestions?)
For someone who is really into music, there is a real and tangible joy in discovering something no one has heard of . . . its like discovering a land nobody has ever stepped foot in.
So, I don’t think James has to defend that!
It is awesome to find something new and turn other people on to it. This is a very, very common thing, read Gladwell’s “Tipping Point”; it is how ideas are spread.
But to his other points: I would argue that it is not just corporate promotion that propels a band like U2. U2 did something that huge amount of people really loved.
Now people who are music-philes, might say that its quality is just ok, but the masses who don’t want to think about it, loved it.
I think that is fine, its kind of like difference between a $100 bottle of wine and a $20 dollar bottle of wine: 95% of the public couldn’t tell them apart, me included! If it tastes like alcohol then its fine by me.
As far as the quality of the music industry . . . hmmm, is it the same thing that is affecting the movie industry? because that sucks too . . . “Trash”, whoops I mean “Crash”, I left that movie with the biggest head ache from getting hit over the head so many times.
And as far as bands producing bad work as a result of success, maybe.
Maybe it is just the nature of success: when you are poor and lack recourses you have to be more creative. I think that describes the problem better than “corporate pressure”
I think that it is a rare artist who can maintain the creativity that propelled their success. Creativity is simply problem solving, thats all it is, and when you don’t have as many “problems” to solve, your art can suffer.
Most of my favorite musicians are unknowns, but I can’t see how that makes me a music snob. Shannon Worrell, Devon Sproule, Peter Griesar, Corey Harris, Brady Earnhart, The Hackensaw Boys, Lauren Hoffman, The Hogwaller Ramblers, and John D’earth are all among my very favorite musicians. I can’t see that it makes me a snob that they’re not more famous—their lack of fame is hardly my fault.
Death Cab For Cutie kicks all @ss in the known universe.
Alright, well, they don’t really kick any @ss.
But they are awesome.
Cory-
My recommendation is to give New Order’s “Brotherhood” a listen, as it’s by far their finest album (in my never-humble opinion).
And you’re perfectly fine to go on not liking Guns ‘N’ Roses. Because they suck.
love,
Patrick
Waldo, he said repeatedly throughout his posts (ok, maybe 4 or 5 times, but still…) that he was a music snob. He seemed to wear it like a badge of honor. I don’t think I was off base criticizing him for being a snob.
James, I agree with the majority of your last post. You’re not really a snob, in the “I want to be cool” sense. You just like different stuff.
Same thing with you Waldo. I’ve never seen you post about what you like in an effort to further your “cred”.
What I was ranting against were people who think they’re cool in being under-the-radar with their musical choices. As if that somehow defines them. (james has qualified his statements and his post proves he’s not one of those people).
I like many underground bands and I like many popular bands. None of my choices should define me or tell YOU (collective or individual) anything about who I am. Or make me cool or uncool. As Jon said, discovering new music is one of the joys of my life. It is a passion. I have a problem with people who name drop unknown bands thinking they are better than those who don’t know those bands. That’s stupid.
Anyone who has read Nick Hornby’s High Fidelity will know what I’m talking about. The theme is: It’s not what you like, it’s what you’re like, that matters.
P.S. Also, just read this from Waldo: “you’ve got a hobby horse of people who like things that you don’t know about”. No, sorry, I am aware of all the bands mentioned. That was the point in my original P.S. mentioning both Animal Collective and Tom Petty. I know the music, I just don’t think it’s a crime to like, for instance, U2 AND Prefuse 73.
yeah, i mean, i WAS calling myself a snob. it’s a half-joke self-depricating humor thing. maybe it doesn’t work too well over the internet. whatever, no offense has been taken or incurred. i don’t really care if you internet-strangers think i’m a snob or not, i’m just trying to add some interesting thoughts to the conversation.
i’m gonna go listen to Negativland’s “U2” now.
“…i just can’t seem to find it. i have kissed honey lips, and i’ve felt the feeling in her fingertips… i’ve even done that! and while i was doing that, you know, all the kissing on the honey lips, it burned like fire, and it reminded me of cheap melting plastic…”
Thanks Patrick, will do.
Oh and Waldo. Your list makes you more of a local than an indie snob. I’d say they are slightly different breeds. Or perhaps I’m trying to dodge the snob badge. Nah. I’ve openly called myself a music junky. They just seem to be different crowds. Maybe it’s a genre thing.
Hey, any readers of http://questionablecontent.net/ ??? Seems like the crowd.