We’ve now been in Iraq longer than we were in WWII. We defeated Germany and Japan in less time than it’s taken us to let Iraq crumble into civil war.
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Open source, procurement, and gov tech.
We’ve now been in Iraq longer than we were in WWII. We defeated Germany and Japan in less time than it’s taken us to let Iraq crumble into civil war.
Comments are closed.
United States troops remained in Japan through 1952, and West Germany in 1949. And even then, the United States remained heavily involved in both countries for decades.
And what so many times is neglected is that the War in Iraq has become part of the greater War on Terror. The war on terror is never, ever going to be a quick battle because we are hamstrung while terrorists hide amongst civilians. This means that our involvement in Iraq may have to be extended, at least until the Iraqi military is ready to take over those efforts within their own borders. Japan and Germany did not have ideologues that organized the way Iraq and much of the rest of the Middle East does.
And personally, staying too long sounds better than quitting too early. Israel may soon have to deal with Hezbollah again; better to stay active than to allow complacency to settle in too fast.
Besides, the actual war ended four weeks after we invaded and took Baghdad.
The state surrendered a long time ago.
Not disagreeing with you too much though Waldo, just your semantics. Shenseki and Powell were right. Rumsfeld and Cheney are wrong.
Not sure why, but my name in the previous comment had Kellam’s funky screen capture from ages ago. Sorry.
Why is it so hard to understand the war on Terror will take generations! It took generations for the brainwashing to take place. We sat back and felt 10′ tall and bullet proof and did nothing to stem the brainwashing and terror taking place in the rest of the world, now that it was finally felt on American soil, it became real!
Get the big picture folks these people don’t like America and have been programed to do anything to destroy the “Great Satan.”
Those of you who want to cut and run and leave the problem for your children and grandchildren, why don’t you just cut and run from the US altogether since it’s so horrible here. Oh, I forgot you already have!
Tom, that’s the sort of rhetoric that goes over well on AM talk radio, but please don’t insult me and this blog’s readers with “cut and run” and “love it or leave it.” The same is true of exaggerated rhetoric on the other end of the spectrum. Blogs can and must do better than relying on tired, hollow talking points and the demonization of our friends on the other side of the partisan divide.
Jim and CR both made good points. If you have any to make, I hope you’ll do so, too.
Here Jerry’s post makes it for me!
http://blogfromonhigh.blogspot.com/2006/08/mission.html
War in Iraq is NOT a war on terror. It is a war of terror, as is all war. Declaring war on terrorism is nonesense given to us by the spin-doctors and politicians who want to fund perpetual fear and funding for security and defense contractors.
Terror is inseparable from the human experience. When a child threatens to beat up another child for lunch money it is extortion in the specific sense, but it is a form of terrorism.
Our “nuclear deterrent” is terrorism on a scale difficult to imagine. We cannot declare war on terrorism, as it is and remains, an idea. A behaviour type.
To declare war on terrorists like al-caeda is silly rhetoric. They are criminals, and their crime is horrific; but to “war” on them lends the illusion of glory to their cause. Treat them like slimy criminals.
The whole war on terrorists rhetoric would have made some sense if it was used to mobilize Americans into action, but no… this administration said to continue business as usual. This “war” is nothing but a distraction so they can fleece Americans as much as they can while we are distracted or in fear.
The War on Iraq was simply a adventure in colonialism. It is reprehensible on so many levels that it is hard to clearly list them; and Waldo’s comparison to time involved in WWII is useful to illustrate how much is being wasted to make a few munitions companies, reconstruction and defense contractors richer than they already were.
Sadly the “Mission Accomplished” banner was horribly accurate. Before bombs started falling the mission of fleecing American taxpayers of their money and soldiers of their lives was already a stunning victory for Bush’s few true constituents.
I don’t think the analogy really works. Strickly speaking Europe was dealing with Hitler from at least as far back as 1938, with official “hostilities” starting sometime in 1939.
‘CR-UVA’ also makes a good point when he notes: “United States troops remained in Japan through 1952, and West Germany in 1949. And even then, the United States remained heavily involved in both countries for decades.” And we still have military bases there today.
I’d also guess there’s a huge difference in the casualty numbers between WWII and Iraq, even taking into consideration the Iraqi civilians who died.
But that’s just my 2 cents.
TvlnMn you just brought up my next point.
Let’s look at the casualty numbers.
http://www.unknownnews.org/casualties.html
http://web.jjay.cuny.edu/~jobrien/reference/ob62.html
Let’s see would we still be fighting if we had numbers like those of WWII.
Thanks for letting us know why the War on Terror or Brainwashing, drags on. Only 34 million + casualties to go before the end.
I think things worked out pretty well last time we cut and ran.
http://www.edwebproject.org/sideshow/
“War in Iraq is NOT a war on terror. It is a war of terror, as is all war.”
“Our “nuclear deterrent” is terrorism on a scale difficult to imagine.”
I enjoy reading crap like that. I was in downtown Roanoke yesterday and had the opportunity of witnessing a PEACE VIGIL. There were about twelve mostly really old people standing silently along the sidewalk, holding signs that read, “War is no answer….” Well, you know the drill.
If I hadn’t had little Kaid and Jayla with me, I’d have made up a sign that had an arrow pointing to these throw-backs with the accompanying words, “Cannon Fodder.”
It was rewarding in one sense. I thought these people had all died years ago. Good to know some still have their (physical)health.
Jerry
“Cannon Fodder.”
The truth is that our nation’s “Cannon Fodder” does not include those “throw-backs” – it does include those who are too poor to have any alternative than the military, and too cowed to understand they can stand up against the government that sends them into an illegal and pointless war. It certainly does NOT include the wealthy, nor the children of the wealthy, nor any of those idiots that put us into this war.
If you believe in this war so much, WTF are you doing here blogging? Go fight in it.
I completely stand my the “crap like that” that I wrote last night. It’s inherent truth is self-evident. Have some coffee and orange juice, splash some cold water on your face. Most of all THINK! You are a human being and you can do it. Wake up and see how the new Republican party has hood-winked you.
Nixon would never have tolerated this kind silliness. He’d beef up the FBI and first responders and we’d treat the perps like ignominous criminals that they are. No glory. No Jihad. Simply crime and punishment. What the heck happened to decent statesmen?
I can assure you I haven’t been hoodwinked by anyone. I trust no one.
I “don’t believe anything I read or hear and only half of what I see.”
I traveled this country and Canada everyday for 10 years. I’ve been wanting to wage war against these terrorist for longer than that. The War we have just begun to wage is way overdue. If we had started earlier they would have less support and resources.
Tom James wrote:
Army Recruiting
143 Zan Rd, Charlottesville, VA
(434) 979-7161
And here’s my weapon of choice:
http://www.military.com/Data/Popup/New_Education_Popunder.htm
I have my honorable discharge papers and am in to poor physical condition to be accepted.
I don’t think you would want me in a position of authority in the military. I’d give warning to the civilians to vacate. Make them pass through a check point, and document them. Then I would turn the sand to glass so there was no where for the terrorist to hide. You can’t play patty cake. It’s all or nothing. My world is Black and White. No shades of grey.
How long you been out of the service Tom?
Don’t worry, after a while all that military propaganda that prevents you from identifying with your targets wears off. It takes several years at least.
Don’t get me wrong, I see it as necessary propaganda. Soldiers can shoot other human beings if they really see them as human beings, so it is necessary to train them to think of the enemy as monsters.
I was in Misawa Japan in the 1980s, so close to Vladivostok that we took our air-raid drills seriously (mach 2 flight time between Misawa and Vladivostok is only a couple of dozen minutes) and close enough to listen to Radio Vladivostok (which had laughable English language propaganda and excellent classical music). I bought into the whole “the enemy is ruthless and will do anything” stuff for a while too… until we realized they are human too. Their problems and their priorities might be different, but they are also the same.
We start turning places to glass as you suggest, and we all have to life with the impact and after-effects. It’s one small blue marble we live on, and we have no back-up plan if we much this marble up.
We have to start learning to live together. People who cannot live together will have to be eliminated, and that means from all extremes (extreme left and extreme right, individual terrorist, state-sponsored terrorist, people who only see things in black and white and cannot tolerate differences).
Evolve, adapt, survive.
Interesting!
I’ve been out since 83′.
“We have to start learning to live together. People who cannot live together will have to be eliminated, and that means from all extremes (extreme left and extreme right, individual terrorist, state-sponsored terrorist, people who only see things in black and white and cannot tolerate differences).”
How did this turn into not tolerating differences? Look who wants to eliminate a fellow American? Maybe your the enemy? I thought you had freedom of speech in this country, you can’t handle that. Do my words threaten your view of the world?
Terrorist have vowed to kill you and your family!
And this isn’t the first time in history.
http://www.mrdowling.com/606-arabs.html
When Muhammad, the founder of Islam, died in AD632, Abu Bakr became caliph. Caliph means successor, or “one who comes after.” Abu Bakr wanted everyone around to world to follow Islam and “to submit to Allah.” H.G. Wells said, “With a faith that moves mountains, he set himself simply and sanely to organize the subjugation of the entire world to Allah – with little armies of 3000 or 4000 Arabs.”
http://view.atdmt.com/VON/iview/btcmxvon0600000020von/direct/01?click=
Why did Rome Fall?
There are some adherents to single factors, but more people think Rome fell because of a combination of such factors as Christianity, decadence, lead, monetary, and military problems. Even the rise of Islam is proposed by some who think the Fall of Rome happened at Constantinople.
Since not all viewpoints are available on the Internet, this list of theories about the Fall of Rome is limited:
Decay
Financial Problems
The Dole and Barbarians
Economic, Military, Gradual
Christianity
Vandals and Religious Controversy
Division of the Empire
Lead
Hoarding and Deficit
http://www.aina.org/guesteds/20051126120420.htm
“It is not Christianity that first assaulted Islam with sword but the other way round. Constantinople, the Holy City of Eastern Orthodoxy, was besieged twice in quick succession by Arabs in 674 and 678 AD before once again in 717 AD. But most people have forgotten that how Arab had threatened Rome.
Will Durant informs-“In 846, eleven hundred Moslems landed at Ostia, marched up to the walls of Rome, freely plundered the suburbs and Churches of St. Peter and St. Paul, and leisurely returned to their ships. Seeing that no civil authority could organize Italian defense, Pope Leo IV took charge, bound Amalfi, Naples, Gaeta, and Rome in alliance, and had a chain stretched across the Tiber to halt any enemy. In 849, the Saracens made another attempt to seize the citadel of Western Christianity. The united Italian fleet, blessed by the Pope, gave them battle, and routed them…By 884 they were expelled from the peninsula. But their raids continued, and central Italy lived through a generation of daily fear….Italy, perhaps Christianity, had had a narrow escape; had Rome fallen, the Saracens would have advanced upon Venice; and Venice taken, Constantinople would have been wedged in between two concentrations of Moslem power. On such chances of battle hung the theology of billions of men” (The Age of Faith P. 290).”
Was it Patton who said the object of the game is to “kill more of them than they kill of you”
By Black and White I am referring to getting a task done. You want to worry about “colateral damage” worry about it on your soil after you and your loved ones are safe. Kill the “nice, humans” terrorist first before they take your right to criticize me and kill your loved ones. Or haven’t you seen enough innocent people outside of the middle east die yet?
Glad your no longer standing watch protecting my loved ones. And hero’s like Gunney Sgt.Michael Burghard, are!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://blogfromonhigh.blogspot.com/2006/08/mission.html
HISTORY TEST
Please pause a moment, reflect back, and take the following multiple choice test. The events are actual cuts from past history. They actually happened!!!
Do you remember?
1. 1968 Bobby Kennedy was shot and killed by
a. Superman
b. Jay Lenno
c. Harry Potter
d. Muslim male extremist between the ages of 17 and 40
2. In 1972 at the Munich Olympics, athletes were kidnapped and massacred by
a. Olga Corbett
b. Sitting Bull
c. Arnold Schwarzenegger
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
3. In 1979, the US embassy in Iran was taken over by:
a. Lost Norwegians
b. Elvis
c. A tour bus full of 80-year-old women
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
4. During the 1980’s a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by:
a. John Dillinger
b. The King of Sweden
c. The Boy Scouts
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
5. In 1983, the US Marine barracks in Beirut was blown up by:
a. A pizza delivery boy
b. Pee Wee Herman
c. Geraldo Rivera
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
6. In 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked and a 70 year old American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard in his wheelchair by:
a. The Smurfs
b. Davy Jones
c. The Little Mermaid
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
7. In 1985 TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens, and a US Navy diver trying to rescue passengers was murdered by:
a. Captain Kidd
b. Charles Lindberg
c. Mother Teresa
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
8. In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by:
a. Scooby Doo
b. The Tooth Fairy
c. Butch Cassidy and The Sundance Kid
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
9. In 1993 the World Trade Center was bombed the first time by:
a. Richard Simmons
b. Grandma Moses
c. Michael Jordan
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
10. In 1998, the US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by:
a. Mr. Rogers
b. Hillary Clinton, to distract attention from Wild Bill’ s women problems
c. The World Wrestling Federation
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
11. On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked; two were used as missiles to take out the Twin Towers and of the remaining two, one crashed into the US Pentagon and the other was diverted and crashed by the passengers. Thousands of people were killed by:
a. Bugs Bunny, Wiley E. Coyote, Daffy Duck and Elmer Fudd
b. The Supreme Court of Florida
c. Mr. Bean
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
12. In 2002 the United States fought a war in Afghanistan against:
a. Enron
b. The Lutheran Church
c. The NFL
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
13. In 2002 reporter Daniel Pearl was kidnapped and murdered by:
a. Bonnie and Clyde
b. Captain Kangaroo
c. Billy Graham
d. Muslim male extremist s mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
14. In 2004 – Spain Railwayy bombings.
Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
15. In 2005 London Railway bombings
Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
AND NOW !
16. August 10, 2006 – 21 arrested in terror plot to blow up planes in midair enroute from London to the United States by detonating liquids stored in carry on luggage.
Muslim male extermists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40
Nope, I really don’t see a pattern here to justify profiling, do you?
So, to ensure we Americans never offend anyone, particularly fanatics intent on killing us, airport security screeners will no longer be allowed to profile certain people. They must conduct random searches of 80-year-old women, little kids, airline pilots with proper identification, secret agents of the President’s security detail, 85-year old Congressmen with metal hips, and Medal of Honor winning and former Governor Joe Foss, but leave Muslim Males between the ages 17 and 40 alone because of profiling.
Let’s send this to as many people as we can so that the Gloria Aldreds and other dunder-headed attorney s along with Federal Justices that want to thwart common sense, feel doubly ashamed of themselves – if they have any such sense.
As the writer of the award winning story “Forrest Gump” so aptly put it, “Stupid is as stupid does.”
Come on people wake up!!!